Archive for the ‘Giants in Those Days’ Category

When Scientists Find Evidence of Dinosaur Tracks and Human Habitation Together in China, Great Scientific Questions or Controversy Could Arise: Bring in the Folklorists and Begin the Mythologizing!

Church of Darwin, Dinosaurs in Literature, Giants in Those Days, s8int.com, Science, Unexplained Artifact | Posted by Chris Parker
Nov 26 2012



In all reality is understandable why real scientists might want to bring in a folklorist to explain how humans and dinosaurs never lived together and to make sure that the evidence is cast in a way so as not to even bring that thought into consideration. That’s because most paleontological explanations concerning dinosaurs, man and the history of the planet is just plain folklore.

Adrienne Mayor came alongside science a few years ago by trying to explain away the incredible number of art artifacts that depict “griffins” with the same attributes and features across time and cultures. She thought it was because they all came across the same beaked ceratopsian skulls. (We believe them to be depictions of a certain type of pterosaur. See prior article on griffins.

Ok Mayor is also a “historian of ancient science”, bleeeh, and she connects the three-toed dinosaur tracks which are prolific at the location with the three lobed lotus flower etc. etc. No one is wondering if this site in fact might indicate that man and dinosaurs themselves interacted. They’ve changed the subject completely. They are so convinced that they are millions of years apart that such a conclusion is never even a possibility in their minds. Bring in the folklorist.

Where’s the evidence that man and dinosaur interacted evolutionsits ask, while immediately dismissing any actual or potential evidence that might so indicate as impossible. Au contraire here is one article posted here providing evidence of dinosaur and human interaction from inside the dinosaur.



Finally, here is a Chinese painting which provides pretty good evidence that the ancient Chinese encountered and interacted with real dinosaurs in the last several thousand years-and not just with their footprints. The painting is “Arhats (holy men) Ding Yunpeng. Ming dynasty, 1368 – 1644 B..C. Red and color on paper.” Shanghai Museum- and it is here compared with a bi-pedal “dragon” with the correct number of “fingers” and toes as well as head crest to be a depiction of the Guanlong dinosaur whose fossils have been found in China…s8intcom



The original painting and our article “Crouching Dragon, Hidden Dinosaur Part 2 can be Read Here

World’s only evidence of co-existing humans, dinosaur tracks found in China
10-27-2011 CCTV.com from

BEIJING/CHONGQING, Oct. 16 (Xinhua) — A team of Chinese and American scientists have discovered the world’s only evidence of co-existing human beings and dinosaur tracks in a remote county in southwest China’s Chongqing Municipality, according to a paper published Saturday in the Geological Bulletin of China, a Chinese core academic journal.

Qijiang County’s Lianhua Baozhai, which means “Lotus Mountain Fortress” in Chinese, has a large number of dinosaur tracks as well as a well-preserved fortress and historical epigraph, forming a direct line of evidence that ancient Chinese people built a residence and lived there for a long time, said Xing Lida, one of three researchers with the project as well as a doctoral degree candidate with the Department of Biological Sciences of the University of Alberta in Canada.


Chinese people could have lived here for more than 700 years, and the mud cracks, ripple marks and duck-billed dinosaur tracks were considered by them to be lotus leaf veins, water environment and lotus, respectively, which is why they named it the Lotus Mountain Fortress, Xing Lida told Xinhua.

“Research shows that dinosaur tracks impacted ancient Chinese place names and folklore, so place names and folklore can be major clues for us in tracing dinosaur tracks,” Xing said.

According to the paper, the Lotus Mountain Fortress dinosaur tracks, the largest track group of cretaceous dinosaurs in southwestern China, contains 350 to 400 footprints that had been preserved in many ways, including concave footprints, convex footprints and multilayered footprints.

“We found a lot of interesting relics that had been associated with lotus by local residents. The ripple marks, mud cracks and duck-billed dinosaur tracks had created a picture of a lotus field, and lead to the folklore of ‘booming golden lotus from the earth,’” he said.

Chen Yu, another researcher with the project as well as an archaeologist with the Capital Museum in Beijing, said the region had been a transport hub for China and other Asian countries, where Buddhism thrived.

“The religion has a special worship towards lotus, which symbolizes peace and quiet. This is another reason for the residents to name the place for the flower, seeking blessing from the Buddha,” Chen said.

Qijiang County was located in what, historically, was a frontier area, and had endured wars at that time. The Lotus Mountain Fortress had been a safe hiding place since the Han Dynasty (202 BC- 220 AD), according to the epigraphy of various dynasties, she said.

Adrienne Mayor, the third researcher with the project as well as a historian of ancient science and a classical folklorist with Stanford University in the United States, said the case of the Lotus Mountain Fortress proves that dinosaur tracks had impacted ancient Chinese folklore, which could provide clues for seeking other tracks.

The fortress’ 700 years of history is a rarity in the world, and reflects China’s traditional philosophy of the relationship between humans and nature, she said.

Video Link

Update: The Biggest Out of Place Artifacts Ever? Immense, Stupendous Petrified Trees of the Black Hills, South Dakota

Giants in Those Days, s8int.com, Science, The Flood of Noah, Unexplained Artifact | Posted by Chris Parker
Nov 23 2012



Photo: Portion of gigantic petrified tree laying horizontally on the ground. Here we could be looking at a stump or a branch with a circumference of 130 to 150 feet. Black Hills, South Dakota. Photo Copyright Joseph C. Bennett. All Rights reserved.

Gen 7:17 “The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits. Every living thing that moved on land perished—birds, livestock, wild animals, all the creatures that swarm over the earth, and all mankind. Everything on dry land that had the breath of life in its nostrils died. Every living thing on the face of the earth was wiped out; people and animals and the creatures that move along the ground and the birds were wiped from the earth. Only Noah was left, and those with him in the ark.”

……..”this isn’t “rocket science”. Any self respecting boy scout can identify petrified wood.” www.beholdgiants.com

We first met Joseph C. Bennett almost three years ago, online when he forwarded some incredible photographs and made some incredible comments to go along with the photos. Joseph Bennett was the discoverer of a phenomenon that if true would require a radical re-examination and realization by science of the true history of this planet.

Photo: Right. Colossal trees neccessarily must have colossal seeds/pits, right? Mr. Bennett proposes that this is such a photo of a gigantic, petrified seed or pit at the Black Hills site. Photo by and Copyright Joseph C. Bennett. All rights reserved. Do not duplicate.

This post isn’t so much as an update as a restating of the original discovery and an opportunity to restore links to photographs.

Also, Joseph has made a video providing significant details of the discovery in terms of his explanation for the gigantic artifacts that he is diplaying pictorially. Joseph’s original site is no longer up, but if you are on facebook you can see approximately 140 pictures that he has located there.


Unfortunately, the detailed descriptions and explanations that were on the main site are no longer there.

Bennett is working on enhancing the material and promises to come back on line with a new site and with the new material that he has gathered over the years.

Our original short post on this topic is still one of the most popular posts on the site. In short, the discovery is this:



“An entire island, 50 x 100 miles, completely petrified. Covered with the petrified remains of a forest of super giants. Trees of incredible/impossible size, destroyed by a cataclysm that collapsed the island itself into the surrounding sea.

Having remained secret for all time. Now, this place has decided to make itself known. Here is just the beginning of an astounding photographic documentation of this petrified island. A little glimpse of an entirely unknown condition upon the Earth. Giants indeed.” Joseph C. Bennett www.beholdgiants.com

Photo:The bark on this stump or branch can be seen on the upper right of this photo. Black Hills, South Dakota. Photo Copyright Joseph C. Bennett. All Rights reserved



Bennett believes that he has discovered a gigantic, petrified forest of mind blowing dimensions in the Black Hills of South Dakota. If these artifacts are what they appear to be to the discerning an open minded eye; the remnants of forest of gigantic trees; where did they come from? In the history of the planet, at what time would an island of giant trees like this have existed?

Science has its own ideas about the many petrified forests (smaller trees) that have been discovered around the world;

“A petrified forest is a forest made out of fossil or petrified wood. In other words, a petrified forest is a forest made out of stone trees. Petrification is a natural process that occurs when all organic material in a tree dies and is replaced by a combination of quartz, copper, iron, and other minerals. Once the process has been finalized, petrified wood is no longer considered wood, and it becomes classified as a stone. In fact, petrified wood is Washington’s official stone. All petrified forests are national monuments and are carefully protected.

A petrified forest becomes such over the course of million of years. Some of the world’s largest petrified forests are an estimated 100 million years old” Wisegeek.

The Bible of course provides another version of history; that the whole earth was at one time covered in water above the mountains in a global flood less than 10,000 years ago. In 2011, what is being called the world’s largest tree was discovered in Redwood National Park in California. The tree named Hyperion reaches a height of 379 feet.

Scientists recently concluded that the maximum height of a tree is 425 feet under current gravimetric conditions. So how does one account for trees in the past of such huge size as to be impossible to imagine–up to 1/2 mile in circumference (distance walking around it)–and larger? For instance, a 900 foot petrified tree found in Texas in 1927 had “upright trunks are so large that they appear from a distance to be great symmetrical columns of natural rock.” A 900 foot tree should not have been possible under the current gravity of the earth–but Bennett claims evidence of trees much larger even than this. Perhaps the trees were as large as this in the Garden of Eden?


….”When you get to the top of one particular ridge, overlooking a long meadow to the south and a larger valley to the southeast, you see a vast landscape, littered everywhere with large petrified tree sections similar to the ones you have seen so far. Then when you look out a little further, you notice right away that things get a lot bigger and you realize that everything else you have seen is most certainly smaller giant trees and branches of much larger giant trees.

Wow. Time to burn some brain calories. First, is this for real?”..www.beholdgiants.com
Photo above: In the foreground; Mount Rushmore. In the background; gigantic broken off tree stumps?

Joseph Bennett made these discoveries while hiking in the Black Hills of South Dakota himself. As he says, these artifacts aren’t going to go away. Anyone with the time, a little knowledge and the inclination can verify these discoveries-and their implications themselves.


We don’t have the ability to understand the satellite maps in the same way that Mr.Bennett sees them. We are on board with the notion that he has a number of photographs proving that there are gigantic, petrified trees there at the site (the smaller trees). We think that he has more work to do to prove that the really super big trees which appear to be small mountains are really broken off tree stumps. He promises to come forward in the future with some additional, mind blowing artifacts.

The facebook site of a number of these photographs is:Black Hills Petrified Giants

Video Link to BeholdGiants.com

All photos Copyright Joseph C. Bennett
Hey Chris,
Spot the giant log?

Joseph C. Bennett


  

Following is an additional, large scale view of the location with several huge stumps described.

Click the photo to see a higher resolution version.


When Really Big Human Giants Left Their Imprints On the World; There Were Giants in The Earth in Those Days

Church of Darwin, Giants in Those Days, s8int.com, Science, The Flood of Noah, Unexplained Artifact | Posted by Chris Parker
Oct 07 2011

Left:”Goliath’s Footprint”; South Africa

Imagine that you’re sitting on your backyard patio sipping an iced tea when a dragonfly with a 30 inch wingspan flies over your fence and starts buzzing the pool. What do you do?

I’ll bet you won’t stay out in the backyard. You sure don’t want to encounter any relatively sized mosquitos that he might be after.

No need to worry though, because while dragonflies with 30 inch wingspans once did live on the planet, such a creature could never get off the ground today.

A large dragonfly today might weigh as much as an ounce but due to the scale effect, a dragonfly with a 30 inch wingspan would probably have weighed a pound or more.

In Genesis Chapter 6 we are told that “there were giants in the earth in those days”. Back in my childhood bible class days we were told that Goliath was about 9 feet two inches tall. That’s the way most believers take the whole “giants in those days” quote; that it referred only to human giants who might have been a couple of feet taller than the tallest of men today. However, the 30 inch wingspanned dragonfly advises us to think of giants in a different way.

Photo:Hornless rhino 17 feet at the shoulder and Argentavis Magnificens

If there once was a raptor bird with a 26 foot wingspan, beavers the size of a small car and dinosaurs 100 feet long; how big were the people? Maybe “there were giants in those days” means that at one time everything was much larger than it currently is.

What we know for sure is that we have fossils of creatures who were extremely large versions of their living cousins and/or who could not fly, run or hold up their heads under the current atmospheric and gravitational conditions.

In this article we want to take a look at some evidence of really big human giants. Not the giants of the Goliath variety; a bit over 9 feet tall but the kind of giants in whose eyes we would be like grasshoppers.


“And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight” Numbers 13:33

Frankly these giants are so big that they are almost embarrassing even to us; to those who do believe that there were giants in the earth in those days as the Bible says -but never suspected that they could have been as BIG as some of the evidence suggests….S8INT.COM

Goliath’s Footprint

“Did giants exist on earth?

This interesting rock formation may suggest so.


Goliath’s Footprint, as the locals dubbed it, is one of South Africa’s little-known secrets. Nestled in the forests near the Swaziland border of South Africa, this print is definitely not a tourist hot-spot. One may speculate that erosion caused the interesting shape of this upright rock formation, but it features exactly five “toenails,” and it looks like the earth has been pushed away around the big toe.

If I encountered this photo on the internet, I might have attributed it to Photoshop techniques and have had some doubts about its existence, but I have been to the spot, and felt the grooves with my own fingers. It is very real.

If this mystery of nature was indeed made by a giant human, I don’t think I would have wanted to encounter him! Locals in the area are all mystified by the footprint. South African folklore does contain mentions of giants, but up to date I haven’t heard any stories about the origin of this giant footprint. Some say that there are similar rock formations in India and in Australia, but an internet search has not given me any results.” Source: http://numbi.hubpages.com/hub/African-Mystery-Goliaths-Footprint

These next three articles all relate to some extremely large apparently human footprints discovered in the South Bay Area of California. Science has fallen into the habit of claiming that these footprints are carved-without showing in any way that the carving of giant footprints in rock as hard as granite in any way related to any cultural or religious practices or beliefs of the Native Americans they attempt to credit. The size of these footprints–on the side of a cliff-in granite make the idea of carved footprints rather incredible.

Dr. Louderback of the University of California is sent to investigate. He was one of the learned men who had decided that the giant human footprints (much smaller-only about 21 to 22 inches long) discovered near Carson Nevada were merely the fore tracks of a bear into the hind feet making what appeared to be left right human tracks-over 100 of them….s8int.com

Depressions on Cliff Near Mission San Jose Furnish Basis for Study
Oakland Tribune – September 19, 1926, Oakland, California
MISSION SAN JOSE. Sept. 18.—

With the finding near here of a cliff marked with depressions having the appearance of prehistoric footprints, gigantic in scale, science has been enlisted to study the mysterious markings. Some months ago similar markings were found near Livermore.


The cliff here is located on the John A. Bunting ranch, high in the foothills, three miles east of Mission San Jose. One of its indentations resembles a human footprint, and- measures five feet in length.

Close beside it is a second indentation, cast on the same gargantuan scale, and resembling the footprint of an animal. – Both imprints, or depressions, are on the face of the cliff.

The indentations near Livermore are of the same extraordinary size.

One of the depressions on the Livermore cliff measures ten –feet in length and even more strikingly resembles a human footprint than the same footlike depression found on the cliff on the Bunting ranch.

Specimens from the cliffs, which are of sandstone formation, have been sent to Prof. George D. Louderback, head of the department of geological science, University of California, who has expressed an interest in both the Mission San Jose and Livermore imprints and will determine their origin.

Giant Footprints Found at San Jose
BERKELEY, Oct. 6. 1926 Oakland Tribune—

The discovery by Professor George D. Louderback of the University of California of depressions resembling the footprints of prehistoric man and animals on a cliff near San Jose about five feet in length, are to present an absolutely new problem to anthropologists.

The prints tally somewhat with similar impressions found at Livermore some months ago, according to Professor Louderback, with the exception that the Livermore finds were about ten feet in length.

Professor Louderback is now working on this problem, using specimens obtained from each location.

MORE GIANT FOOT PRINTS DISCOVERED
IN WASH. TOWNSHIP
The HAYWARD SEMI-WEEKLY Tuesday, September 29, 1925

The footprint, thought to be of prehistoric origin, discovered by James Higgins high on the rock formations of Bushy Peak, is claimed to be duplicated in at least two other spots in Washington Township.

Pioneer residents claim a “footprint” similar to the description given by Higgins of the one on Bushy Peak, only of greater size can be seen on the John Bunting ranch near the Mission San Jose.

This footprint measures nearly eight feet in its length. It is said, and is very deeply embedded In solid rock.

The third mysterious foot mark is said to hare been seen on the Indian Reservation, near the Pleasant Valley road, between Sunol and Pleasanton. This foot-print, like the others, is of immense size and deeply marked on a granite cliff.

Attempt to locate these prehistoric marks was made several months ago by John Harrington, a representative of the Smithsonian Institute, who is investigating Indian lore In California.

Harrington was notified of the find made by Higgins and expects to be here in the near future to picture the foot print and lead the search to establish the exact location of the prints at Mission San Jose and the Indian reservation.


 

 

Re the following: But wait; I hear you skeptics (and you right thinking people as well) “what complete idiots they must have been in 1919 to believe that they had found a fossilized human just shy of 33 feet tall”. Need I remind you that many cling like Linus to his blanket to a theory by Chas. Darwin which was almost 70 years old at that time? Or that the atomic bomb was created only 26 years later? It was not simply some misidentified bone; it was an entire fossil over 30 feet long.

If not human, then still; what 33 foot vertebrate is there out there who at that length wouldn’t be mind blowingly large?…s8int.com

FIND FOSSILIZED MEXICAN GIANT

Vera Cruz. Mexico. Oct. 21, 1919 Syracuse Herald

— The fossilized remains of a giant, taller than any ‘human being on record, has been found by workmen in the tiny village of Nanacamilpa, near here. Several scientists are en route from Mexico City to investigate the find. Scientists admit that the fossil appears to resemble a human being, but are of the opinion that it is a vertebrate.

12/18/1919
FIND BONES OF 32-FOOT GIANT
Postville Herald – November 7, 1919, Postville, Iowa

Natives of Mexican Village Who Cling, to Ancient-Traditions, Guard Remains as Sacred.
Mexico City. The fossilized remains of a giant measuring 32 feet 10 Inches in height were, according to a report recently discovered by workmen near the little village of Nanacamilpa, State of Vera Cruz.

The natives, who still cling to many of the traditions of their Indian ancestors, declared the giant was related to the gods of their forefathers.

They erected a catafalque in the plaza on which the giant rested in state for many days, covered with flowers and
at night carefully guarded. The discovery attracted the attention of scientists here. Manuel Ganomo director of anthropology at the National museum, expects to leave soon for Nanacamilpa to investigate. He is inclined to believe the fossil is that of an prehistoric vertebrate not a human.

300 Pound Ancient American Ax
American Anthropologist Volume 8 1906 By American Anthropological Association

A Remarkable Stone Ax.

—”What is believed to be the largest Indian stone ax in existence has recently been placed on exhibition among the collections of the Missouri Historical Society, at St Louis, by its president, Dr C. A. Peterson, by whom the specimen was procured as a loan. This noteworthy object is of granite; it measures 28 inches in length, 14 inches in width, and 11 inches in thickness, and weighs more than 300 pounds.

The ax was obtained by George M. Huss, of Birchwood, Wisconsin, from an eminence in one of the wildest sections of the territory still occupied by the Chippewa Indians of Lac Court Oreilles and Lake Chetac, in Sawyer county, Wisconsin. When found the pointed end was embedded in a small mound of bowlders and pebbles, with the body and head of the ax exposed, the whole apparently forming a shrine or altar.

In shape the ax resembles a tomahawk pipe; its upper end or head is slightly hollowed out and in this depression was ceremoniously placed a small quantity of tobacco. A well-beaten moccasin trail led up the incline of the eminence on which the shrine stood, indicating that the place had long been used for religious purposes.

The ax for a time formed the keystone of a chimney, but was removed temporarily for a loan exhibit. According to Chippewa tradition the ax has been held in veneration by these Indians from time immemorial. The object will remain in the care of the Missouri Historical Society until spring, when it will be returned to Mr Huss, who, it is hoped, will deposit it in some public museum rather than permit a repetition of the vandalism to which it was once subjected.”

“Adam’s Footprint”

Sri Pada (also Adam’s peak; Sinhalese Samanalakanda – “butterfly mountain”, is a 2,243 metres (7,359 ft) tall conical mountain located in central Sri Lanka. It is well-known for the Sri Pada “sacred footprint”, a 1.8 metres (5 ft 11 in) rock formation near the summit, in Buddhist tradition it is held to be the footprint of the Buddha, in Hindu tradition that of Shiva and in Muslim and Christian tradition that of Adam.

Source: Wikipedia Article

See Also:There Were Giants in the Earth in Those Days-28 Pages

The Attenuated Gravity of the Antique System

Recent Post: Human and Dinosaur Inner-Action; Unfortunate Humans Provide Evidence of Interaction with Dinosaurs from Inside Their Stomachs

Crouching Dragon, Hidden Dinosaurs-How Evolutionary Science Hides Historical Man and Dinosaur Interaction in Plain Sight

Human and Dinosaur Inner-Action; Unfortunate Humans Provide Evidence of Interaction with Dinosaurs from Inside Their Stomachs

Church of Darwin, Crypto, Dinosaurs in Literature, Giants in Those Days, s8int.com, Science, The Flood of Noah, Unexplained Artifact | Posted by Chris Parker
Sep 13 2011

Photo: One of thousands of Acambaro Figurines from Pre-Hispanic Peru

Why are there no fossils showing that man interacted with dinosaurs; dinosaur bones which have been gnawed or perhaps dinosaur fossils in association with human fossils or even dinosaur tracks along with human tracks? If you believe that that kind of evidence has not been found, you are assuming facts that are not in evidence.

They’re not in evidence largely because facts that don’t fit the dinosaurs and man never intereracted paradigm are systematically; ignored, suppressed, explained away or relegated to the fringe.

Here are three historical articles that seem to tell another story. By the way, sea monsters (aquatic reptiles) aren’t dinosaurs but they are said to have gone extinct more than 65 million years ago along with the dinosaurs…..s8int.com

FOSSIL PUZZLES IN LOS ANGELES
The Los Angeles Times
December 2, 1900

“Lately there have been unearthed at the north end of Eastlake Avenue, in the foothills surrounding East Los Angeles, some of the most curious fossils ever seen. Nothing just like them has ever been found, and the puzzle is, how they came to be there.

Nature, in her mysterious way, has hidden the explanation, but she has not concealed the fact of their existence; for there they lie, in two great strips, probably forty feet long and ten feet wide. Whoever chooses may go see for himself.

By far the greater number of these unique specimens resemble in and general outline the vertebrae of some enormous animal”.

The article goes on to puzzle over related fossils that appear to bear a very close resemblance to leg bones, noting a rough surface and that they are “somewhat hollow.”

By leg bones, the author soon lets it be known-he means human leg bones in association with a huge animal that could only be a dinosaur.

According to the writer, behind the leg bones was a great very heavy piece which to all the world appears to be a “gigantic human skull”. In proximity to the skull are what appear to be a gigantic pelvis and a correspondingly large thigh.

These items may be noted in a photograph that appears with the article. (If anyone lives in Los Angeles and has access to an archive of the paper they might want to take a look at that photo; Dec 2, 1900).

The author explains that the soil in which these fossils were found has the chalky, carbonous character of soil in which oil is often found.

“The Geologists Have Their Theories

The geologists had been out to see the fossils and so immediately their creative abilities were put to use in order to “normalize” the discovery. One popular theory is that a highly impregnated, mineral rich stream of water had flowed over tree roots or other vegetation to form the large, regular shaped spine like fossils and leg bones.”

Among those clinging tightly to this theory were Prof. John Merriam of Berkeley and E.W. Claypole of Pasadena.

Claypole believed in a variation of the theory that just barely excluded fairies. The author of the 1900 article thinks that these theories fall a bit short on account of the various sizes and shapes of fossils which stubbornly continued to look like animal remains.
The author and perhaps Mr. Towner, the discoverer, believe that the bones are the vertebrae and the remains of a giant saurian.

Mr. Towner invited everyone who had a theory to share it.

“One day this week there was unearthed something that passes all the other specimens, a shape that can barely be mistaken in its identity, and yet from its position, condition and surroundings, is a wonder study. How such a piece could have been preserved so long, or where it came from, or whether it be really the head bone of prehistoric man or not; all these are questions to be answered.

Yet the same skull is apparently that of a human skull, with perfect ridges on the sides. It hardly seems possible that the gigantic leg and other bones could have belonged to one with so small a cranium, yet scientists tell us that the troglodyte, or cave-dwelling man was of enormous stature, with very small brain capacity.”

Photo: From the Original Article


According to the article, there appeared to be a head wound on the skull which no doubt contributed to the man’s death. This explains why the bones of man and dinosaur are “so weirdly intertwined”; the giant man and giant saurian were locked in mortal combat and both had perished as a result.

“What a fight that must have been! Fancy some great man with arms a foot or two longer than our current largest man, and of such stature as we have never contemplated, engaged in deadly struggle with a monster of the Saurian type.”

The author argues that this man was no slouch for he gave as much as he got.


Human Skeleton Inside Mammoth Carnivore with Eight Pound Teeth
Another What Was it?
November 2, 1877, Carthage Montana Patriot

“Mr. Henry Woodard owns a stock rancho in the Indian Territory, in the Peoria Nation, on which is situated the big sulphur spring. The spring is surrounded by a quagmire, which is very deep and slushy, and so soft that it will not bear any considerable weight.

Mr. W lately undertook to curb up the spring in order to get water more easily, and while working in the mire came upon what appeared to be an enormous bone. He at once began an examination which disclosed the fact that it was the head of some mammoth beast.

His curiosity was aroused, and, with the assistance of three other men, he began the work of excavation. For four days they worked, but did not succeed in bringing the monster to the surface. They threw off the marl, but could not lift the head of this golitic giant. They found the skeleton well preserved, and the immense teeth still sat in the jaws.

The jaws were both in place and the spinal column attached to the cranium. The earth was thrown off from the body to the length of twenty feet, but still the gigantic skeleton remained beneath. Three of the front ribs were forced out and proved by measurement to be each eight feet in length.

The dirt was removed from the inside of the osseous structure, and there lay the skeleton of a human being, with one hundred and two flint arrow points and fifteen flint knives. The cranium indicated that it was the skeleton of an Indian.

It would have been impossible for the man to have been inside the animal without having been swallowed by him, and this theory is substantiated by the fact that the bones of the right side of the skeleton were broken and mashed, apparently by force.

The monster, therefore, must have been carnivorous, which is also proven by the teeth, which exhibit the marked characteristics of a flesh-eating beast. A large molar and two incisors, taken from the upper jaw, were exhibited to us at our office yesterday, the largest one weighing eight pounds and measuring eight by four inches in size.

There are two large molars and two blunt tusks on each side of each jaw, the teeth between the molars and the tusks are incisors, having from two to six points and corresponding prongs to each tooth. In front of the tusks the teeth are similar to those of most carnivorous animals in shape.

All the bones indicate that they have lain buried for an incredibly long period, as they crumble rapidly when brought in contact with the atmosphere.

Every circumstance goes to show that these are the largest animal remains ever resurrected, and the teeth, tusks, and structure of the head and jaws prove unmistakably that it was of the carnivorous class.


River Monster that Ate, A Canoe, A Deer and an Indian
The Daily Times, August 25, 1877

Back in the 1800′s a family of “settlers” looks for a suitable Island on which to build a new home off the coast of Northern Alabama. This is an excerpt from the story of their encounter with a dying river monster/aquatic reptile.

“During their visit in search of homes they were induced to go on to the Islands to ascertain if they, or any of them, were of sufficient size to make a settlement.

In order to reach them they procured Indian canoes, made of the bark of trees, in which to cross over the water to the islands. These bark canoes were very small crafts, only of sufficient to carry one, or not more than two persons.

Having prepared themselves for the Inspection of the islands, they set out, and on approaching one, they saw a strange animal of immense size and length about the color of a cat-fish, but more In the shape of a snake, which seemed to have drifted upon the edge of a small island, and was partly in and out of the water, making movements and contortions like it was in the agonies of death.

They approached it. It was partly covered by the water and partly on dry land, but it was of such enormous size and strange shape it baffled all their ideas of such animals, or their knowledge of the whole animal kingdom, but it was certainly a water animal of the snake genre.

After watching its movements and holding a short consultation they determined to kill it if bullets would do so. They then approached more closely; to it and fired several rounds until they discovered that it was dead. Then they went to it for a close examination- to ascertain what it really was, and discovered from the sharp protuberance and unevenness of its body on one side an the evenness of the other that there must be something in it.

When they discovered that they had never seen or heard, or read of such an animal they proceeded with their tomahawks and butcher knives to open it and in doing so, to their utter amazement and surprise, they found in it a bark canoe, the horns and skeleton of a large deer, the skeleton of an Indian, also an old rifle gun such as the Indians of that day used, and bow and arrows.

From finding the above named articles in it and their appearance they concluded that some weeks previously an Indian had-killed a deer, put it into his canoe, and, while crossing the river, the monster had swallowed the canoe, with the Indian, deer and other articles In it. The flesh of the Indian and deer had been digested but the canoe, the gun, the bow and arrows and bones were so indigestible as to sicken the monster, and so enfeeble it that it had floated to where they found it and could not escape from them.

On Propositioning Atheists, Giant Penguins in the Garden of Eden and How Science Works #173

Church of Darwin, Giants in Those Days, Religious, s8int.com, Science, Uncategorized, Unexplained Artifact | Posted by Chris Parker
Jul 14 2011


“God’s wrath is being revealed from heaven against all the ungodly behavior and the injustice of human beings who silence the truth with injustice. This is because what is known about God should be plain to them because God made it plain to them. Ever since the creation of the world, God’s invisible qualities—God’s eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, because they are understood through the things God has made. So humans are without excuse. Although they knew God, they didn’t honor God as God or thank him. Instead, their reasoning became pointless, and their foolish hearts were darkened. While they were claiming to be wise, they made fools of themselves. .” Romans 1

Selfish Genes vs “Skepchick’s” Jeans

It turns out that sometimes Atheists like to gather together in halls and hotels for conferences where they seek to encourage one another in the faith and discuss ways to proselytize. They discuss the sacred writings of their high profs; book, chapter and verse. They listen to speeches (sermons?) from those skilled in dealing with their specific articles of faith and of course they socialize and talk about MythBusters.


Rebecca Watson is a young Atheist who leads a team of “female activists” at Skepchick.org and who gets to travel all over the world delivering talks on science, Atheism, feminism etc. She appears on a number of Atheistic/Skeptical programs and has an internet presence. Considering that she is one of the few female stars in the Atheistic realm she is well known and is apparently sought after as a speaker.

Not long ago she mentioned on a podcast following a conference where she was a panelist with Richard Dawkins a story about being “hit on” in an elevator by a conference attendee. Her comment/request has engendered a fairly nasty response from the Atheist/Skeptic community.

“So I walk to the elevator, and a man got on the elevator with me and said, ‘Don’t take this the wrong way, but I find you very interesting, and I would like to talk more. Would you like to come to my hotel room for coffee?’

Um, just a word to wise here, guys, uh, don’t do that. You know, I don’t really know how else to explain how this makes me incredibly uncomfortable, but I’ll just sort of lay it out that I was a single woman, you know, in a foreign country, at 4:00 am, in a hotel elevator, with you, just you, and–don’t invite me back to your hotel room right after I finish talking about how it creeps me out and makes me uncomfortable when men sexualize me in that manner…”

Ms. Watson went on to mention that a number of women she knew did not like to attend these types of conferences because they were “hit on” so frequently and she avowed that this served to limit the number of women in the movement. She went on in a blog about the incident above;

“So here we are today. I am a feminist, because skeptics and atheists made me one. Every time I mention, however delicately, a possible issue of misogyny or objectification in our community, the response I get shows me that the problem is much worse than I thought, and so I grow angrier. I knew that eventually I would reach a sort of feminist singularity where I would explode and in my place would rise some kind of Captain Planet-type superhero but for feminists. I believe that day has nearly arrived.”

Richard Dawkins, the world’s most famous non-believer responded to her advice and concern regarding the elevator incident in a sarcastic message that began;

“Stop whining, will you”? From there it went down hill.

Now, much of the Atheist community is at war (of words). Ms. Watson has received more than 1,300 comments on her site alone and many other acrimonious conversations are taking place elsewhere on the web.

Here’s the thing; why is Ms. Watson surprised by any of this?

As a leader in the Atheistic religion hadn’t she studied its history? Didn’t she know that a powerful force behind the rejection of Christianity and religion in general was “sexual freedom”? It was the burden of morality and the requirement to adhere to societal standards (which drew their inspiration from the Bible and Christianity) that provided a primary motivation for unbelief.

This is something that Christians have been pointing out for decades and that Atheists have tried to argue against; that a powerful motivation for Atheistic beliefs both in the formation of modern Atheism and in many Atheists today is freedom from exogenous moral values.

Aldous Huxley, a famous and influential Atheist of the 1960’s and grandson of ground floor Atheist/philosopher Thomas Huxley explains:

“I had motives for not wanting the world to have meaning; consequently assumed it had none, and was able without any difficulty to find satisfying reasons for this assumption . . The philosopher who finds no meaning in the world is not concerned exclusively with a problem in pure metaphysics; he is also concerned to prove there is no valid reason why he personally should not do as he wants to do . .

For myself, as no doubt for most of my contemporaries, the philosophy of meaninglessness was essentially an instrument of liberation. The liberation we desired was simultaneously liberation from a certain political and economic system and liberation from a certain system of morality. We objected to the morality because it interfered with our sexual freedom.”—*Aldous Huxley, “Confessions of a Professed Atheist,” Report: Perspective on the News, Vol. 3, June, 1966, p. 19

We could give additional examples but Ms. Watson probably now has hundreds if not thousands of additional, personal examples to draw from. How dare someone, and particularly a woman and particularly one from their own community suggest that there be any restriction on their sexual freedoms? Is she trying to describe a morality that Atheists and particularly male Atheists should have to adhere to, they wonder?

What’s the point in rejecting God if at the end one has to lead a moral life anyway? What’s the point in imagining an entire scheme that makes you an accidental life form in an accidental universe with no one as your boss only to have someone acting as your boss?

No wonder that Dawkins, the titular head of the Darwin party had to step in to try to set things right. As an Atheist, he probably has a hard time even figuring out why she would selfishly say no, anyway. What’s the big whoop he must wonder? Just selfish genes trying to replicate, after all. Dawkins made the notion of selfish genes famous in his 1976 book wherein every action and reaction of man can be seen as selfish genes seeking to propagate themselves. (No doubt many would object to this definition)

The signers of the Declaration of Independence had it right (borrowing from the French) when they said that governments derive their just powers from the consent of the governed, a proposition that would hold true with respect to government for both Christians and Atheists. However, the cornerstone statement in the Declaration is “we are endowed by our Creator with certain inalienable rights” supersedes even the consent of the government and places those rights and moral responsibilities in the hands of a greater power, God. Moral systems must be obtained from a higher power than man himself since if all men are equal then they are each equally capable of deciding on their own what is wrong and what is right in their own eyes.

Atheists may accept the idea of government and laws based on the consent of the governed but certainly reject the notion that we are endowed with anything from a Creator. We’re surprised that Ms. Watson, as a high priestess of the faith didn’t know that.
As far as Atheists are concerned, heaven is here on earth and that means they don’t need women (or God) getting in the way of their liberation from restrictions, particularly sexual ones.

On Giant Penguins and Conditions That Must Have Existed in the Garden of Eden and the Early Years of this Planet

There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that…Genesis 6:4

In September 2010, UPI.com had a report about a giant penguin fossil discovered in Peru:

“The fossil of a giant red penguin, nearly twice as tall as the largest living species, has been discovered in Peru, U.S. paleontologists say. Standing 5 feet tall, nearly twice the height of an Emperor penguin, the fossil, discovered in Peru’s Reserva Nacional de Paracas and nicknamed Pedro, is 36 million years old, the BBC reported.” UPI, Sept. 30, 2011

For those gentle readers who like to play “stump the creationist”, take note. All penguins do not live in the the Arctic or under Arctic conditions. There are penguins living today in a warm South Africa (rather that a cold South Pole) for instance and that’s how Noah found penguins in “Palestine” for the ark.


Science has given these giant penguins its own species name but the fact of the matter is; they are simply penguins. If you were to see one today you would recognize it not as some evolutionary predecessor to the penguin, but as a penguin—albeit a very large one. These giant creatures of the earth’s past are an unexamined and an unexplained problem for the theory of evolution and the life of this planet.

When Genesis reports that there were giants in those days, I think many Christians assume that the text suggests that some of the people in those days were giants and that some survived after the flood. Fossil evidence suggests an alternative; perhaps every creature was created as a relative giant in those days and after the flood, some vestiges of the time of the giant creatures remained.

Fossil evidence suggests that besides giant reptiles, there were giant turtles, penguins, clams, humans, dogs, sheep, fish, deer, rodents, rhinos, insects, birds etc. in the past life of this planet. These giant creatures are as recognizable as are there smaller relatives living today. Evolution does not explain why there was a period in the earth’s history when all creatures were gigantic forms of the same creatures living today.

Kansas giant print 44 inches long-from Valley of the Giants by C.N. Dougherty.

Mary Leakey was one of the discoverers of chimpanzee bone fragments which became known as Lucy which was put forward by paleontologists as a human ancestor back in the early 1970s. You remember that. You don’t remember that her husband Louis Leakey found an “inexhaustible supply of human bones” along with “traces of dinosaurs” in Kenya at Nakeru back in the 1920s because that’s how “science” works. Source: The Montreal Gazette – Sep 24, 1927

Louis Leaky made an even more amazing discovery in keeping with our giant penguins and Garden of Eden theme. As reported in the New York Times of May 11, 1958 Leakey discovered the complete skeletons of gigantic animals along with evidence of giant humans at Olduvai Gorge in East Africa. The New York Times article was entitled; “Gigantic Fossils of Animals Found, East African Expert Cites Sheep as Big as Horses, Hogs with Elephant-Like Tusks”.

Here are excerpts from the article:

“London May 10—The remains of gigantic animals, including sheep as big as present-day carthorses and hogs with tusks like elephants have been dug out of an ancient gorge at Olduvia, in East Africa.

Two giant human teeth have also been found….”

“…Specimens have been brought to London for comparative studies by the man who found them. He is Dr. Louis S.B. Leakey, director of the Coryndon Museum at Nairobi, Kenya.”

“….But the most remarkable character of the Chellean Age was he says, the gigantic size of the animals existing at that time. Dr. Leakey has found the complete skeleton of a Pleistocene sheep with a horn-span of fourteen feet. It was about as big as a big cart-horse, he says. He has also unearthed the bones of wild hogs the size of a rhinoceros with elephant sized tusks.

He has found a giant giraffe, baboons as big as modern gorillas, massive zebras and antelopes. But his most important find from the point of view of the evolution of man is two giant teeth. They are either from a Chellean child or they are from another species of man hunted and eaten by cannibalistic Chelleans. (They appeared to be primary or “baby” teeth).

They are undoubtedly human and larger than any previously discovered. One molar is bigger than that of the mature molars of Peking Man (up to 9 feet tall).” NYT

Leakey attributed the gigantic size of the animals of this time with “trace elements” washed down into the gorge and then consumed by the animals of the gorge.


Despite their protestations to the contrary, Darwinists have no answer for these gigantic versions of currently existing animals. A beaver the size of a modern black bear; an armadillo the size of a Volkswagen, giant oysters in the mountains of Peru 12 feet wide, a type of deer 7 feet tall at the shoulder 8 foot roly poly’s, dragon flies with two foot wingspans, a super croc the size of a boxcar, rodents the size of a bull are outside of current Darwinian understanding to say nothing of 5 foot penguins.

Many of these creatures simply couldn’t exist or function under current gravitational conditions. Sauropods likely could not have lifted their heads. Argentavis magnificens, an eagle like raptor and the largest bird ever discovered could not have flown under current gravity conditions. Very ancient depictions of mastodons show them galloping like a horse. Currently living elephants are too big to run or gallop.


The question is when did these creatures live in the history of this planet? From an evolution perspective; what evolutionary advantage would giant versions of today’s animals have over there smaller cousins? Why is the only difference between the gigantic animals of yesterday and today’s smaller versions their size? Where are the other adaptations that must have taken place over allegedly millions of years? Why would they evolve to large size and then to small?

A 1987 article in Time Magazine might provide a clue; it was entitled Putting On Ancient Airs”, and informed that “two scientists stunned colleagues by reporting that 80 million years ago, (sic) the earth’s atmosphere contained about 50% more oxygen than it does now.”


Geochemists Gary Landis of the U.S. Geological Survey and Robert Berner of Yale were able to measure ancient air trapped in amber. Naturally we don’t subscribe to the age given as 80,000,000 years ago, but it does raise the possibility that at one time on this planet there was much more oxygen to breathe in the atmosphere than there is now. The comparison is 21% oxygen today vs. up to 35% oxygen in the past.

Why did gigantic versions of man and creature live in the earth’s past? Genesis provides the best answer; there were giants in those days…

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Giant Beaver Fossils with Facts and Pictures.
Scientists Discover “Giant Fossil Frog from Hell” –
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Giant prehistoric fish species found in forgotten fossils (Wired UK)
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Giant Tree Fossils

How Science Works #173

First of all, we have no idea whether we’ve correctly numbered these “How Science Works” articles. That’s how we work.

Recently, we noted that archaeologists had virtually been forced to acknowledge that an incised bone discovered at Vero Beach Florida was an actual ancient artifact that proved that elephants or mastodons had lived in North America in the ancient past.

They then declared it to be the first such representation in North America. We can’t figure out if that is a bold faced lie or simply a demonstration of real ignorance on the subject as literally hundreds if not thousands of similar depictions have been found in North America over the last several hundred years. Science just managed to declare all previous artifacts “fakes” or simply ignored them.

This is how archaeology works. Theories are promulgated. A consensus is formed and later a paradigm is created.

Evidence that fits the paradigm is catalogued and embraced; evidence that contradicts the paradigm is ignored or falsified. This process is absolute since one countervailing piece of evidence that is permitted to “exist” could weaken or threaten the paradigm.

This is actually how many human systems work to be honest; it’s just that many believe that science is exempt. It is not.

A number of gentle readers of a certain persuasion have asked; where is the scientific evidence, for example of human and dinosaur interaction? Why they ask, haven’t dinosaur fossils ever been found along with evidence of human bones or artifacts? Why are no human fossils found in such and such a strata? We have to assume that these questions are sincere and that they simply don’t know how science works.

Here is a simple case of how science works that may serve to illustrate the paradigm protection apparatus in action.

Frank Calvert (1828–1908) was an English expatriate who was a consular official in the eastern Mediterranean region and an amateur archaeologist. He began exploratory excavations on the mound at Hisarlik (the site of the ancient city of Troy), seven years before the arrival of Heinrich Schliemann. Calvert was the youngest of a family of archaeologists…Wikipedia

“In 1874, Frank Calvert found in a Miocene formation in Turkey (along the Dardanelles) a Deinotherium bone with carved figures of animals upon it. Calvert noted: “I have found in different parts of the same cliff, not far from the site of the engraved bone, a flint flake and some bones of animals, fractured longitudinally, obviously by the hand of man for the purpose of extracting the marrow, according to the practice of all primitive races.” Nature 27 March 1873

This report was made in scientific magazines of the day however; the elephant-like deionotherium was supposedly never seen by modern man. “Modern humans” were supposedly nonexistent in the Age science called the Miocene. On top of that, the deionotherium bone had a number of incised creatures upon it including what people with normal vision might call a dinosaur.
What happened next?

The paradigm protection system went to work.

“In Le Prehistorique, de Mortillet (prominent evolutionist/scientists) did not dispute the age of the Dardanelles formation. Instead he commented that the simultaneous presence of a carved bone, intentionally broken bones, and a flint flake tool was almost too perfect, so perfect as to raise doubts about the finds.” ..Forbidden Archaeology

The following denunciation of the discoveries is a classic of its kind:

“The pretended discovery by Calvert of human prehistoric handiwork in the Miocene of the Dardanelles near Constantinople proves to be unfounded, the supposed tracings on a piece of bone turning out, it is stated, to be merely the eroding work of some crustacean.” Harper’s magazine, Volume 49—Editors Scientific Record, 1874

Finally, here is someone, a scientist, trumpeting the destruction of all evidence proffered by members of their own scientific fraternity of the remote antiquity of man. It should be noted that the Christian view of this phenomena (remote antiquity of man) is that man has existed as long as the world has existed. Here is the “how science works” quote.

“Much of the evidence which had been prominently put forward in support of the high antiquity of man has, during the past few years, been completely abandoned. Thus:—

The Abbeville human jaw from the gravel of the Somme is acknowledged to be “a plant.”

The Paleolithic “beads” of St. Acheul are found to be organisms of the chalk.*

The human bone from the Victoria cavern, which Professor Boyd Dawkins once described as “establishing the fact that man lived in Yorkshire before the glacial period,” and who added, that “the man to whom it belonged was probably devoured by hyenas,” has now been pronounced to be the bone of a bear; \ and a “cut” bone, said to have been found in an undisturbed layer in association with the extinct mammals in the same cave, belongs to a domestic sheep or goat, both of which were unknown in Europe before the Neolithic age.

Some of the artistic drawings upon the fossil bones found in the Thüringen Cave in Switzerland, are now pronounced to be spurious, and the result of intentional deception. The same drawings are contained in a work published six years before the discovery of the cave.

The reputed discovery of relics of man 800 feet deep in a Miocene deposit at the Dardanelles, by Mr. Frank Calvert, is now utterly rejected.

The supposed dressed flints from Miocene beds at Theney,** the “worked ” flints from the Pliocene beds of St. Prest, and the supposed basket-work from lignite, in Switzerland, have all broken down under a searching examination.

And I claim, on the evidence adduced in former papers read before this Society, to have stamped out the evidence of Paleolithic man from the “famous” cavern of Brixham.

But above all we are indebted to the Woodwardian Professor of Geology at Cambridge for the important statement,—that the evidence for the antiquity of man has completely broken down in all cases where it has been attempted to assign him to a period more remote than the post-glacial river gravels.” THE SUPPOSED PALEOLYTHIC IMPLEMENTS OF THE VALLEY OF THE AXE. By NICHOLAS WHITLEY, C.E. 1883

Conclusion: In order to maintain the paradigm science lies to both creationists/Christians as readily as it lies to Evolutionists/Atheists.

We wonder if evolutionists even care? After all, it’s their paradigm that is being preserved.

See Also Mega Fauna Section
The Real Story of Vero Beach Wasn’t Ancient Mammoth Art but Rather; Ancient Mammoth Humans and Mammoth Archaeological Misdirection

The Real Story of Vero Beach Wasn’t Ancient Mammoth Art but Rather; Ancient Mammoth Humans and Mammoth Archaeological Misdirection

Church of Darwin, Crypto, Dinosaurs in Literature, Giants in Those Days, s8int.com, Science, Unexplained Artifact | Posted by Chris Parker
Jun 24 2011


There could be no better metaphor for modern science, particularly archaeology than Dr. Zaius from the movie “Planet of the Apes”.

When that Minister of Science found the talking human doll in a cave which would have overturned his scientific paradigm he had the cave sealed and the eyewitnesses arrested.

This week, the Huffington Post published a story about ancient mammoth art discovered at Vero Beach Florida which managed to both bury the lead and to seal the real archeological experience of North America in a cave, metaphorically speaking.

The original article announcing this discovery was published in 2009 so it’s a bit of a mystery why this article is being published now. (We had our own article last year). However, here is an offensive quote from the article:

“While prehistoric art depicting animals with trunks has been found in Europe, this may be the first in the Western Hemisphere, researchers report Wednesday in the Journal of Archaeological Science”

Seriously? Are you kidding? There have been literally hundreds of prior discoveries of “prehistoric” art in the Americas depicting animals with trunks. The problem was, mainstream archeology had decided and pronounced that elephants or “animals with trunks” had not lived in North America and so discounted all evidence to the contrary.

A few examples of art depicting animals with trunks are shown at the top of the page. Another famous example is a pictograph discovered in the Grand Canyon in 1924 by Samuel Hubbard Jr. along with dinosaur and human footprints, petrified giant human bodies and pictographs showing dinosaurs. This was the Doheny Expedition and Hubbard had brought along Charles Gilmore, Curator of Vertebrate Paleontology of the Museum of Natural History to certify his discoveries.

In the Vero Beach find we had the same pedantic initial skepticism but this time the paradigm was unable to relegate the piece to the cave and it has been grudgingly accepted. Now the field is trying to feign excitement about it. And what of all those other pieces of trunked art that have been discovered over the past three hundred years? Can you imagine that now that science has to admit that the mammoth was here in ancient times after all that nevertheless this is the first and only representation of the huge creature ever found?

As to burying the lead, Vero Beach, Florida first became famous and controversial back in 1917 when then State Geologist and later Director of the Bureau of Economic Geology, Elias Sellards and colleague reported that they had found numerous bones, fossils, weapons etc. of “modern” men from 10 to 12 feet tall, along with the bones of extinct creatures and giant reptiles in Pleistocene strata. Given that scientific report and the controversy it engendered, why in the world is anyone talking about an etching of a mammoth on bone?

When it comes to the science known as Archaeology, or at least to its practioners, one can learn more from the mammoth paradigm supporting misdirections than one can learn from an incised bone portraying a mammoth…..s8int.com

GIANTS INHABITED FLORIDA IN THE YEAR 123,084 B. C.
State Geologist Sellards and Prof. Hay Concur in Opinion After Study of Fossil Found at Vero-
Say Men Grew 12 Feet Tall.
New Smyrna Daily News Jan. 5, 1917

Background

“Elias Howard Sellards, earned his bachelor’s and master’s degrees in 1899 and 1900, respectively, at the University of Kansas at Lawrence. He was awarded both a scholarship and a fellowship at Yale University, where he completed his doctorate in paleontology in 1903.

After graduating from Yale, Sellards taught geology and mineralogy for a year at Rutgers College, before becoming a professor of geology and zoology at the University of Florida in 1904. In 1907 he was named the first state geologist of Florida and held that position until 1918.” University of Texas Source

He was serving in that position when he found giant human bones near Vero Beach, Florida. He was later to serve as director of the Texas Memorial Museum from 1938 to 1957. In 1932 he became the director of the Bureau of Economic Geology, the source of this information. His discoveries were very controversial both because of the strata where the bones were discovered and because of their size.

Dr. OP Hay, co-discoverer was from the Carnegie Institution.

Smyrna Daily News Jan. 5, 1917–“That human beings inhabited the North American continent more than 125,000 years ago has been conclusively proven through a recent discovery in this state by E. H. Sellards, state geologist, and Prof. Oliver P. Hay who have made a study of the fossil. Though their opinions are not fully concurred in by other scientists, they are positive that their researches have been thorough and there is no room for a mistake.

The discovery was made several months ago, and though nothing of a definite nature had been given out until recently, it is now officially stated that human bones intermingled with those of the mastodon, saber tooth tiger, and many other extinct animals that formerly ranged this hemisphere have been found. The deposit was found near Vero.

That the human beings were of enormous size is evidenced by the bones. It is thought that some were ten or twelve feet in height. Some excellent specimens of the skeleton of these gigantic men have been found, some of them locked in the deadly embrace of great animals, with strange weapons of bone clutched in skeleton hands a foot long.”

Sellards and Hay must have known that their professional reputations would be at stake after such an announcement. Sellards did leave for Texas the following year. But to claim that human remains had been found in North America in the Pleistocene period and of a size that science claims never existed was unprecedented and incredible-twice over. No wonder they waited several months prior to the announcement.

They supposed that so many ancient animals had been found in association with the human bones because they had died together “locked in deadly combat”

A group of six; including anthropologists and geologists quickly arrived on site and eventually wrote a report which was published in Jan-Feb issue of the Journal of Geology. In that report, Sellards is quoted as saying that this was the oldest deposit from which human remains had ever been taken. Note that what Mr. Sellards meant is that these were not the bones of some ape being passed off as a pre-human.

The article continues on: If this research proves to be all that the scientists think it is, the world at large will be astounded to know that many things which had long been suspected are true. (There were giants in those days?)

There are many who believe Bering straight was crossed ages ago by inhabitants of European countries who probably had to flee across the Stnnovoi Mountains of Siberia.

The claims that Sellards and O.P. Hay were making did not sit well with many scientists and the debate raged for many years with the paradigm working to show that the bones really came from a much higher and thus geologically younger strata (intrusion). (Of course, I do not personally agree with the geological timescale the current scientific paradigm advances, either.)

One can find many articles about these discoveries by searching Google for Vero Beach and the Antiquity of man. Rarely if ever do we see Sellards’ claims about the stature of the ancient men addressed. He did not leave himself without testimony however, as photographs of some of the bones, human and animal can be found online at the State of Florida Library website.

Left:Ulna of man, #5895, anterior view]
Publication info: 1916.
Physical descrip:
1 photoprint : b&w ; 5 x 7 in.
Series Title:
(Florida Geological Survey Collection.)
General Note: Used in 8th Annual report, pl.18, fig.2. Found in stratum 3 at Vero.
Date/place captured:
Photographed in February of 1916.

Tibia (right) of man, #5196, and right ulna (left) Canis dirus, #5451] [picture]
Greene, E. Peck.

This source: Lists many news articles and provides other research material descriptions and locations

Sellards defended his findings in among other reports; FLORIDA STATE GEOLOGICAL SURVEY.
E. H. SELLARDS, PH. D., STATE GEOLOGIST. NINTH ANNUAL REPORT.

His Report Conclusion: “The human remains and artifacts are contemporaneous with extinct species of mammals, birds, reptiles, and at least one extinct species of plants, as well as with other animal and plant species that do not at the present time extend their range into Florida. The age of the deposits containing these fossils according to the accepted interpretation of faunas and floras is Pleistocene.”


Epilogue: University of Florida: Epic carving on fossil bone found in Vero Beach

In what a top Florida anthropologist is calling “the oldest, most spectacular and rare work of art in the Americas,” an amateur Vero Beach fossil hunter has found an ancient bone etched with a clear image of a walking mammoth or mastodon.

According to leading experts from the University of Florida, the remarkable find demonstrates with new and startling certainty that humans coexisted with prehistoric animals more than 12,000 years ago in this fossil- rich region of the state.

Source

Bonus Material: Quote from 1884 Re: The Elephant in North America

MAN A CONTEMPORARY WITH THE AMERICAN ELEPHANT.


Perhaps those who are of the opinion that man dwelt here in ancient times contemporaneously with some species of the extinct American elephant, may see in the close proximity and association of the remains of these huge mammalians with the pottery of the ancient Americans, some evidence favoring their theory.

In fact, the huge elephant mound in Grant County, Wisconsin, which must have been made by a people familiar with elephants; and the engravings of elephants on tablets found in mounds; and the recent discovery in the quarry at Carson. Nevada, of human and elephant foot-marks, one human foot- mark being obliterated by the, subsequent passage of an elephant, the foot mark of the latter showing up beautifully, would seem to be evidence sufficient to establish the fact beyond a doubt, that man and some species of American elephant dwelt in ancient America together.

Prof. G-. Frederick Wright conjectures that the so-called human footprints at Carson, Nevada, were those of a bear, made long by lapping of the tracks of the hind feet into those of the fore feet. He thinks some such supposition necessary to account for the large size of the tracks—nineteen inches in length, six inches across the broadest part of the heel, and seven inches at the base of the toes.

He forgets that there were giants in those days, as is proven by the giant skeletons exhumed from mounds in various parts of America. And then, Mr. Wright’s conclusions do not at all tally with the description of these tracks, by those who carefully examined them, which description shows that; these impressions clearly indicate rights and lefts, and deviate to either side from a straight line about as much as the ordinary step of a man. * *

The hollow under the instep is remarkably prominent, and characteristic of the human foot, as is also the curvature around the toes. The impression is exactly like that of an Indian moccasin pressed into shallow mud. No separate impressions of toes are visible, from the fact that the whole interior of the impression clearly appears as if a sandal had been worn. The sharp line corresponding to the cut edge of a piece of hide is visible everywhere.”

Perhaps instead of a mere sandal, a rawhide shoe, with a sole on it, was worn. This would account for other things noticed. The reporter to the New York Weekly Herald of Nov. 18, 1882, further says:

“I was shown by Prof. Harkness, of San Francisco, the tracing of the sole of a shoe, worn by a Sonoran, which measures exactly eighteen and a half inches, just half an inch less than the fossil footprints.”

He further says of the fossil footprints:
“The straddle or distance between rights and lefts varies from almost nothing to sixteen inches. Neither of the above measurements is remarkable when we consider the proportions of the individual, as indicated bv the size of the feet.”

Besides all this evidence that they are human footmarks, is it not more than probable that, if they were those of an animal, the lap of the hind upon the fore-feet tracks would show somewhere, in so many tracks—over one hundred?

Wilford’s Microcosm: Volume 4 – Page 269 1884

s8int-saint

In Search of the Death Valley Cave System: Giants in Those Days? On The Ground in Death Valley- An Expedition to the Panamint Scorpions

Church of Darwin, Giants in Those Days, s8int.com, Uncategorized | Posted by Chris Parker
Feb 17 2011

Photo:Jef and team on the ground in Death Valley in search of the ancient cave system.

Several years ago, we reprinted an article originally printed in the San Diego Union on August 4, 1947 entitled;” Ancient Civilization Beneath Death Valley? EXPEDITION REPORTS NINE-FOOT SKELETONS.

This was a rather prominent article of the time concerning the alleged discovery of an ancient cave complex located in Death Valley which contained remnants of an ancient civilization and nine foot giants. The story eventually disappeared from the papers but we were able to find some possible collaborative evidence in the form of a mention of the discovery in a government archeologist’s papers.

In recounting the discovery, one of the principals; Hill claimed: “These giants,” said Hill, “are clothed in garments consisting of a medium length jacket and trouser extending slightly below the knees. The texture of the material is said to resemble gray dyed sheepskin, but obviously it was taken from an animal unknown today.”

S8int.com also included a number of other articles concerning the same cave system including descriptions of the area. With the advent of Google Maps and satellite photos of the area, those interested in the story have tried to find the location of the cave system. We’ve since had a number of updates about these aerial, virtual searches. Since our original article s8int.com has added nothing to the story but has only served to print comments and additional stories by others interested in the Death Valley Caves, if they exist.


The “Scorpions”: January 14, 2009 at 18:11 Google Earth:
36 31 23.67 N, 117 03 54.90 W

The search has recently focused on an area known as the scorpions, near Panamint Springs in Death Valley. There is a belief by some that the aerial maps of the area have been “airbrushed”. Scott S. who has supplied some updated material is a guy who has spent some of his vacations searching for the caves for up to a week at a time. He says he only lives 1,000 miles away. Disneyland is closer, I’m sure.

Recently, Jef Anderson, another adventurer and some of his compatriots took the possible coordinates of the cave system and set out for Death Valley. Here is an account of their journey.

Panamint Mountain Scorpions
Who says there’s no Intelligent Design?

Dateline: 2/14/11 – by Jef Anderson
All Photos and Text Copyright Jef Anderson, 2011

Right:Yahoo maps
36 31 23.67 N, 117 03 54.90 W

Below, Left: Bing Maps
36 31 23.67 N, 117 03 54.90 W
As near as I can tell… these images started appearing on all three major satellite mapping websites at approximately the same time – On January 14, 2009 Wouter W. of The Hague, Netherlands found this Google Earth image (the first image), which has since been removed from the Google sites, but can still be found by inputting the Long/Lat coordinates into the other map services.

It’s an extremely curious image, seemingly a massive geoglyph of a pair of Scorpions (or maybe Lobsters) positioned in the heart of the Panamint Mountains, in Death Valley California, and only visible from satellites or high flying aircraft, which would make the size on par with the Nazca geoglyphs.

On February 12, 2011 a group of 7 men set out to reach those GPS coordinates. The demographics of our group was comprised mainly of Educators, a few of them being former History teachers, all with Master’s degrees. Most of the members are experienced High Sierra outdoorsmen, having conquered several 14k peaks, with years of experience heading into extreme conditions.

This experience led us to choose February as the time to attempt this trek. We had great weather, temperatures ranging from 32º to 78º. Sudden thunder storms are really the only danger at this time of year, but we had blue skies and little to no wind. This window of temperate weather only occurs a few weeks every year before the legendary heat returns.

We decided to seize the opportunity.

Armed only with satellite maps and handheld GPS units, we set out from Salt Creek. There are no trails or paths heading toward the Scorpions, so we struck out across the one of the most inhospitable deserts in the America’s. The trackless journey took us across many types of terrain, rolling sand dunes, suddenly deep ravines, rocks ranging from gravel to boulders, and the ground covers with all manner of small cactus and nettled brush. The trek toward the coordinates was a steady climb of about 15º beginning under 200 feet below sea level.

Our base camp was Furnace Creek campground and we tented it, finding the National Parks service campground a nice one (although dealing with the Rangers is always a pain, and 12 Sax was not exception).

At about 6:45am and just before the sun shone down into the Panamint Valley we drove north up Hwy 190 toward the Salt Creek Trail parking lot, arriving around 7:10am. After quickly donning our daypacks, we set the compass and struck out at a heading of 220º. Our first waypoint was Trellis Canyon, though the way was obscured by a sharp, rising ridgeline bordering the salt creek.

The map below shows our starting point at Salt Creek, Trellis Canyon, and finally the Scorpions.

What follows is the log of the expedition.

07:15: Salt Creek Interpretive Trail Parking lot: 36 º 35’ 26.8N, 116 º 59’ 24.3W
- Sunrise, approx. 50º temp
- We climbed a small, steep ridgeline due West, then followed rolling desert
- Heading: 220 º
- Elevation: -200 ft.

07:45: 36 º 34’ 45.7N, 116 º 59 49.3W
- approx 55 º temp
- Now we encountered steep broken ravines cut into the rising desert floor, we were forced to pick our way down into the ravines, often traveling along them for a time before climbing out again, trying to maintain our bearing. Will’s foot issues force him to turn back – very bummed.

- Heading 200 º
- Elevation: – 200 ft.

08:15: 36 º 34’ 22.9N, 117 00’ 6.9W
- Approx 60 º temp

- We are now through the ravines and face a slope rising North by Northwest. It consists of softball to bowling ball size rocks, making the footing difficult. They’re too big to get flat footing and too small to “boulder” across, very annoying. In the distance we see two possible canyons that may be Trellis, so we split the difference between the two, heading toward the center.

- Heading: 200 º
- Elevation: -150 ft.

08:45: 36 º 33’ 43.9N, 117 00’ 46.8W
- Approx 60 º
- Still on the long climbing slope of rocks, we pass power lines and talk about what a miserable job installing those must have been
- Heading 220 º
- Elevation: -50 ft.

09:15: 36 º 33’ 17.3N, 117 01’ 33.4W
- Approx 60 º
- The angle of the slope has significantly increased, though the rocks become smaller, with many places very gravelly. We begin to think that the Northern canyon is indeed Trellis, so adjust out bearing and head that way.
- Heading: 240 º
- Elevation: +283

09:45: 36 º 33’ 7.7N, 117 02’ 34.0W
- Approx 65 º

- The bugs appear. These are little gnats, virtually invisible and SUPER annoying. What could they possible live on when they can’t get humans? We’ve seen no wildlife or water. We take a break in the shade of first set of uprising rocks that will eventually form the canyons, but the gnats are everywhere and we don’t stay long.

- Heading 310 º
- Elevation: +938

10:15: 36 º 32’ 53.8N, 117 03’ 20.0W
- Approx 65 º

- We enter Trellis Canyon. We’ve been shooting for 36 32 55.1N, 117 03 19.11W coordinates and pretty much navigated to the spot, once we decided the Northern canyon was our mark. The bugs are still present but as long as we keep moving they don’t bother too badly. The mouth of the canyon is about 200 yards across with several large rock formations that are evident in the satellite maps.
- Heading: 190 º
- Elevation: +1212 ft.

10:45: 36 º 32’ 13.2N, 117 03’ 35.2W
- Approx 65 º
- We kept working our way back into the ever narrowing canyon. The walls squeeze in, emphasizing the height of the canyon. The outer canyon walls much reach 3000 to 4000 feet up, with the ones we can touch easily over a 1000 feet. At one place in the “Narrows” I can touch both sides of the walls at the same time and yet the canyon towers about 2000 feet straight up – It’s an awesome place, and by the gps coordinates we know we’re getting close to the Scorpions.

All along this part of the canyon, we can see “hanging valleys” open up above us in the rocks. All of them are at least 50 to 100 feet up from the riverbed that we’re walking on. The evidence of water erosion is significant, and it’s easy to see how this canyon was formed, being cut so sharply by the flash floods that race down the narrow canyon. One of these hanging valleys is easy to spot when we climbed a rock wall across from it.

There is now a shear rock wall that must be climbed in order to really see into the valley, but from our view it’s clearly evident that it has a lot of square acreage. It’s now absolutely inaccessible without a 3 or 4 rated climb of over 100 feet. And it’s not alone, we see several places were areas open up, but they’re all very high up in the canyon walls, some 1000 to 3000 feet up. We didn’t plan on climbing, knowing that we wouldn’t have the time. But climbing there is the only way to really explore the mysteries of the place. We believe the coolest stuff is now high up in the canyon walls, and can only be reached by climbing.

- Heading: 190 º
- Elevation: +1524 ft.

11:36: 36 º 31’ 23.67N, 117 03’ 54.90W
- Approx 65 º
- THE SCORPIONS, we reach the coordinates a little after 11:30am.

The narrow sliver of sky we see is still bright blue, with golden sunlight reflecting hard off the towering canyon walls. We however are covered in dark shadow. It’s evident that some places within the canyon never get sunlight because the extremely high walls. I’m not just spouting poetic imagery… this is the point –
The Scorpions are created by shadow. There are so many twisting, turning corners to the canyon that it’s easy to see how the Scorpions are formed.

I’ve been so mystified by the darkness of the Scorpions, when every other shadow on the satellite images are a lot softer. But now, standing in these impressively high and narrow canyons, the darkness of the images is obvious. The contrast of the light and darkness is extreme and the blackness of the shadow in such close proximity to that of the brightly lit rocks, no doubt creates the deep blackness of the satellite photo images.


We’ve found no caves or caverns at ground level, but as I’ve stated, we’ve seen the potential for both high up in many places along the canyon. We also haven’t seen any geoglyphs or any evidence that humans have ever been in this place. BUT, it’s also very obvious that the canyon get scoured by flood waters and has (relatively) quickly sunk down many dozens if not hundreds of feet since the time people may have lived here.

If people did once inhabit this place, the evidence for them wouldn’t be down at the current ground level, but up much higher in the canyon walls and in the suspended/hanging valleys that would have been much closer to ground level long ago.
- Elevation: +2169 ft.

This picture (top article photo) was taken at precisely 36 31 23.67 N, 117 03 54.90 W – the coordinates given by all three satellite map services, showing the Scorpions


The fact that the Scorpions exist in the satellite images is, in my mind, evidence of the awesome creativity that God shows in his creation. No one can deny there are images on the satellite photos, images that are created by shadow and light, yet clearly form recognizable, symmetrical shapes; shapes that don’t happen randomly in nature. It seems this place is marked specially for some reason and though evidence wasn’t observable at ground level, who can guess what kinds of things may be found higher up in the canyon walls.

We’ll be going back, with climbing gear ;)

Prior Articles on this Topic

Ancient Civilizations, Giants, Tunnels Beneath Southern California?
Update on:Ancient Civilizations, Giants, Tunnels Beneath Southern California? Tuesday, December 23rd, 2008

More on Death Valley Cave Complex–Giants Etc. Thursday, January 1st, 2009

Updating the Update of the Death Valley Giants Cave Complex-with Coordinates Monday, January 12th, 2009

Death Valley Giants Cave Complex Satellite Photo Blurred Out? Wednesday, April 28th, 2010

New Update on the Death Valley Cave Complex-Quest for Death Valley Giants and the Cover Up? Scott S. June 16 2010

New Update on the Death Valley Cave Complex Scott S. June 17 2010

How Darwinism Deals with Human Giants: Go Lieth?

Church of Darwin, Giants in Those Days, Science, Unexplained Artifact | Posted by Chris Parker
Feb 10 2011

Numbers 13:33
And there we saw the giants, the sons of Anak, which come of the giants: and we were in our own sight as grasshoppers, and so we were in their sight.

The Quote Box following contains an Email sent to s8int.com by Jim S. which itself contains quotes and references to an article on the website; The Naked Scientists, which is an interview with a South African anthropologist.

Photo: Sellards: giant of early 20th century Florida anthropology and geology.
“As just one example of the “deception” that Jim S. references, Elias Howard Sellards, who became the first state geologist of the State of Florida, found human bones near Vero Beach Florida of what he admitted were “fully modern” individuals he estimated to be between 10 and 12 feet tall. Today, Vero Beach man remains controversial because of his “modernity” but no refererence is ever found concerning his alleged giant stature. A link to that article is at the end of this one.

Following Jim’s email is a news article we’re presenting that appears to be somewhat related….s8int.com

Hello,

Photo: Femur of Ancient Giant compared to normal human

“This is Jim, the guy who found the Castelnau giant report. I recently stumbled across this interesting new bit of information concerning a race of giants in Africa:

Although you will never hear about it in the National Geographic or Nature Magazine, Evolutionist scientists have known all along that races of giants have existed. We all know about Meganthropus and Gigantopithecus, but many skeletons of other giants have been found by anthropologists for decades, and in this rare 2007 interview by “The Naked Scientist” we can get a quick glimpse of some of what has been found.

A 2007 interview with Professor Lee Burger, University of Witwatersrand South Africa reveals some startling clues:”
Prof. Lee Burger -
“One of the most interesting things that the fossil record reveals is that we went through a period of extreme giantism. These were people routinely over 7ft tall, they were huge. This was before we turned into the modern humans of today. ”

” What we’re looking at is the most enormous femur: the bit that forms your hip joint. That’s huge. As a doctor I know how big they normally are, that’s huge.

They are huge. That’s so big we can’t even calculate how big this individual was.”

“….we found a lot of them. Everywhere we find them we find them enormous. These are what we call archaic Homo sapiens. Some people refer to them as Homo heidelbergensis. These individuals are extraordinary, they are giants”

thenakedscientists

Jim’s Remarks Continued:
“This is just another example of the establishment finding races of giants, and trying to reconcile them into their pet ape ancestry agenda. It’s also very remarkable that this race of giants has never made the headlines in Nature Magazine or Nat Geo, whereas the discovery of the 3 1/2 foot tall pygmies on the Island of Flores in 2004 created an Academic sensation with headlines all over the press announcing the discovery of tiny ape men, who were probably just smaller versions of us.

Perhaps they are concerned that if they were to report the discovery of a race of 8 foot tall ancient giants, they would somehow be vindicating scripture and they simply cannot allow this.

Dwarfs and small ape sized men are OK to report, but giants twice our size cannot be reported for fear that Bibles might start thumping and accountability and God might actually exist. Well maybe I am going a bit too far, but you get my point.

God bless,”
Jim S.

United Press Feb. 9, 1929
Drawing by Dan Smith, 1929

Ancient Battle:
Capetown, South Africa. Feb. 9. An important anthropological discovery consisting of the fossil of a gigantic prenegroid man and a huge extinct type of buffalo fossil was announced last night by the Transvaal Museum authorities.

The positions of the fossils indicated the buffalo had trampled the man in a battle.
The skull of the man had been crushed.

The fossil of the buffalo showed that the animal measured 12 feet between the horn tips. The fossils were found near Springbok Flats, Transvaal.

See Also: Giant Men? Evidence; Amen! Giant Tracks? Science Attacks! 12 Feet Tall? Darwinists; Not at All! Historical Evidence That There Were Giants in Those Days-As Alleged by Scientists of the Recent Past

Question re; Giant Human Footprint in Granite

Church of Darwin, Giants in Those Days, s8int.com, The Flood of Noah, Uncategorized, Unexplained Artifact | Posted by Chris Parker
Sep 08 2010

Hi,
just curious about an article on page 2 of ‘giants in those days’ which says a footprint was found in 2002 in granite. Footprints in sedimentary rock makes sense because it was liquid mud at some point, but Granite is usually made volcanically, so it seems strange that any imprint could be made. Either the rock is not granite (probable – an easy enough mistake) or the nephiliim could walk in liquid/setting lava (possible if they were part-supernatural). Any ideas?
Bless, Gerry.

Dear Gerry,

Thanks for your email. You pose an interesting question, I suppose and its certainly one I’ve heard before. My question is; in the absence of a complete understanding of how a giant footprint was captured in granite, who does it pose the most difficult puzzle for, creationists or evolutionists? I say evolutionists. As a Christian, and a believer in the Genesis account, the find does not cause me any problems and in fact is something that I might have expected. Evolutionists would be off by 4.5 billion years.

The very existence of a human footprint in granite, giant or otherwise, falsifies the current scientific thinking on how and when granite was formed. The most common types of granite are thought to be 4.5 billion years old. Clearly according to evolutionists there would be no men around to make such a footprint for nearly 4.5 billion years.

Therefore, assuming for a moment that the footprint is genuine and that it is in granite–how or why would one use the current scientific thinking on the age and formation of granite–to falsify the footprint in granite!? Au Contraire. If the footprint is genuine and it is in granite then we surely can’t then turn around and ask science to tell us how granite is formed!

If on the other hand, the footprint is not genuine or if it is in another type of rock the question of liquid granite doesn’t obtain. Most rock however is supposed to be too old for that “modern” footprint except perhaps Quarternary sedimentary rock. By the way, 70% of the earth is covered with a relatively thin crust of sedimentary rock which dovetails quite nicely with the Genesis flood.

On the very same page is a story about the 1877 discovery of a human knee and leg bone embedded in red quartz. Can we ascertain without examination that this is impossible because science says red quartzite is billions of years old? On the contrary, such a find calls into question everything science tells us about the evolution of man; the age of quartzite rock and/or its formation (if genuine).

Here is another story about giant footprints in granite: Giant Footprints. Here is a “290,000,000 year old” primate bone in a coal formation which is also impossible according to modern science: Primate Bone in Coal for $2 million

By the way, according to Wikipedia The origin of granite is contentious”. I doubt the contention relates to late formation granite but still–even some scientists don’t agree fully with the paradigm for its formation.

I suspect that some granite was mud that later became hardened into “granite” because old newspapers are “full” of reports of “devil’s footprints or the like; footprints of common creatures in granite or other hardened rock which according to current scientific understanding would be impossible.

One thing is sure; either this is a giant human print in granite or it isn’t. If it is, there is no point in considering what science says about granite formation because it would be moot. It would not be scientific or logical to deny a fact simply based on the fact that it contradicts the position that you currently hold.

There is no expression more common in lay articles on science than; “scientists had previously thought”.

take care,

chris

New Update on the Death Valley Cave Complex-Quest for Death Valley Giants and the Cover Up?

Giants in Those Days, Uncategorized | Posted by Chris Parker
Jun 17 2010

Photo: “Giant”Skull at Humboldt Museum

By Scott S.

In 2007 I first started the quest for Death Valley giants.

At the time I hadn’t made the connection that the ancient underground city in death valley and the giant legends are actually not necessarily related. If you dig the only reference to giants in the underground city is of a giant gold statue and if you check Paiute, Shoshone, and Anasazi legends they actually talk about 2 peoples, 1) A giant race of giant cannibals, and 2) another race of “advanced private people living in a cave city high in the death valley mountains”.

But not knowing this yet … A disappointing 1st trip to death valley and a reality check of heat stroke, poor visibility, poor access, inadequate gear, and a clue I found in Death valley Scotty’s castle re-enforcing that he had actually found and “borrowed gold” from the underground city drove me to spend what time I had left tracking down the lost giants.

Using the David Hatcher Childress book on Lost Civilizations of North America guide I was determined to find the lost giants.

My first stop was to the Carson City museum where some artifacts including the giant sandal were supposed to be. As it turned out that wing of the museum was closed for reconstruction. After chatting with the security guard for a while he revealed the following;

“Sorry boys you aren’t never going to see them or anyone else for that matter the “Lovelock” artifacts have all been sent away for “Safe” storage and the only ones going back in the case are some replicas.”

While I never had the chance to go back and see what replicas were put on display I think it hardly matters. The next stop was to Lovelock itself to see the cave. Spending my youth crawling through lava caves, the Lovelock cave was not all that exciting, it was a crack in the cliff with about a 10 X 20 X 10 foot room, empty of course with a sign saying they found some reed duck decoys there with no mention of the giant skeletons.

Onward to the Lovelock Museum which was closed with a phone number on the door saying call to see when it would be open, no answer of course..

My last stop was the Winnemucca Museum. We got there just before closing and while they had an impressive wooly mammoth skeleton the Lovelock display was limited to a couple of stone grain grinders and reed necklaces.

Frustrated I approached the two curators at the museum and inquired about the skeletons. The younger lady tried to redirect my question but after some charming banter the elderly lady asked me if I would like to see the red headed giants? Boy would I ? She took me down into the basement and opened up a cabinet and in it were 3 heads/skulls. Two Indian skulls; one had been clay recreated to show the face when it was alive, and the other was just a skull, but the the 3rd skull was the Lovelock skull and it didn’t look like the Indian skull.

The younger curator tried to turn my attention to the Indian skull and the recreation etc but I didn’t pay her much attention; in a sick twist of fate my camera wouldn’t shoot because the battery was too low.. I know, I know, perfect excuse but I’m be going back this winter to try and trace down the Indian legend of the stone pyramid built by giants in New York Canyon that was destroyed in an earthquake.

I doubt I’ll find any nice rectangular pyramid stone more likely a pile of natural stones out of place but who knows?, and I’ll stop by the museum on my way and get pics of the lovelock skull, if somebody here doesn’t beat me to it know that you know where the last evidence is.

Anyway I honestly didn’t see the Lovelock skull as being “Giant”; it looked pretty close in size to the Indian skull but the elderly curator assured me they had a university professor measured it vs the Indian skull and determined it would be for a 9-10 foot tall man.. but what did strike me was the shape of the skull, it was wider and flatter and most obvious was the eye brow ridges where very pronounced like you would think of a caveman or Neanderthal .

What stuck me as odd was why they recreated the Indian skull and not the giant skull? I mean what’s more useful to science? Why these were hidden in the cabinet vs on display? And why did the younger curator try to get rid of me vs wanting to show it. I asked about what happened to the full bodies and the older curator said University of Berkeley had came and taken all the giant skeletons away for study decades ago and this was all that had survived that grab.

So University of Berkeley has been sitting on giant skeletons for 90 years and has yet to file a paper? Why?

Being excited about my find I called someone I knew who had just finished her archeological degree to which I received “oh that…yeah I know, we are told not to look into this, its pretty well communicated if you research into giants or other races they will end your career immediately, we are told to say its all 1800’s media fraud regardless of the evidence, in fact they think they have found a living tribe of Neanderthals in northernmost Canada, but I don’t know anymore about it, its pretty controversial, again if you ask questions you’ll be working at McDonalds tomorrow”.

So what to make of it? Cover up? Fear to rewrite history book? Who knows anyway Ill get a pic of the skull this winter if it hasn’t been snatched up , and for those of you that want to see it yourself you know where it is, hopefully the elderly curator hasn’t retired yet, and hopefully you can charm you way into the employees only basement…..Scot S.